Fame and Glory - may run on Sunday

Galileo said:
Fame And Glory did not get his trip and conditions after the Irish Derby again - that is what explains his defeats.
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The Irish Champion run must have been at least on a par with his Irish Derby win. Simply beaten by an outstanding colt.
 
davidjohnson said:
The Irish Champion run must have been at least on a par with his Irish Derby win. Simply beaten by an outstanding colt.
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Sorry yeah - his defeat at Leopardstown was down to being beaten by a better horse. The ground was perfect that day, wrong trip but just beaten by a better horse.
 
Wrong trip? If a horse runs to his best over a certain trip, shouldn't we acknowledge he's effective at it rather than stick to pre-conceived ideas over what he may or may not need.
 
davidjohnson said:
Wrong trip? If a horse runs to his best over a certain trip, shouldn't we acknowledge he's effective at it rather than stick to pre-conceived ideas over what he may or may not need.
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Totally agree, DJ. The notion that Fame And Glory needs a mile and a half in a bog is absolute nonsense. The horse has never been been short of tactical pace and I would be fairly hopeful that he would be capable of winning a Group 1 over a stiff ten furlongs granted a sound gallop this year.
 
We shouldn't make excuses for him at 10 furlongs I'd agree, but it's likely that STS brought out an honest effort from him. However, it's likely that Fame will prove best at 12 furlongs, or further. I see he's been entered for the Irish Leger.
 
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davidjohnson said:
Wrong trip? If a horse runs to his best over a certain trip, shouldn't we acknowledge he's effective at it rather than stick to pre-conceived ideas over what he may or may not need.
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He ran to his best over 10 furlongs simply because that was his only opportunity to run to such a level - I think he will produce even better over 12 furlongs with a bit of ease in the ground against high class rivals.
 
trackside528 said:
Totally agree, DJ. The notion that Fame And Glory needs a mile and a half in a bog is absolute nonsense. The horse has never been been short of tactical pace and I would be fairly hopeful that he would be capable of winning a Group 1 over a stiff ten furlongs granted a sound gallop this year.
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Who says he needs 12 furlongs in a bog? Naturally a top class 12 furlong horse will be capable of a big effort over 10 furlongs - but in terms of producing his absolute peak performance I am certain based on his pedigree and style of racing that it will come in a strong run 12 furlong race preferably with some cut in the ground.

He will not run in the Irish Leger - I could see Age Of Aquarius possibly being that type of horse this year.
 
Galileo said:
Who says he needs 12 furlongs in a bog? Naturally a top class 12 furlong horse will be capable of a big effort over 10 furlongs - but in terms of producing his absolute peak performance I am certain based on his pedigree and style of racing that it will come in a strong run 12 furlong race preferably with some cut in the ground.

He will not run in the Irish Leger - I could see Age Of Aquarius possibly being that type of horse this year.
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Just the sort of impression I got from some quarters - not necessarily on here - really.

Will be interesting to see how he is campaigned this year. I would love to see him campaigned agressively - I actually think he is capable of running very well in something like the Prince Of Wales's or the Eclipse as long as the ground isn't. I suspect they might restrict him to a mile and a half after the Tatersalls, though defeat at Royal Ascot hardly did Dylan Thomas any harm comercially I wouldn't have thought. What do you reckon Gal?
 
trackside528 said:
Just the sort of impression I got from some quarters - not necessarily on here - really.

Will be interesting to see how he is campaigned this year. I would love to see him campaigned agressively - I actually think he is capable of running very well in something like the Prince Of Wales's or the Eclipse as long as the ground isn't. I suspect they might restrict him to a mile and a half after the Tatersalls, though defeat at Royal Ascot hardly did Dylan Thomas any harm comercially I wouldn't have thought. What do you reckon Gal?
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I would prefer them to skip Ascot and think of the Eclipse or preferably the Juddmonte International. I do not even think he would be suited to the King George given the likely ground at that time of year. Mind you if he did manage to win that they probably wouldnt be too concerned for the rest of the season as by Arc time the three year olds will be taking on their older horses.

Alot depends on what they want to do with Rip Van Winkle - I wouldn't mind seeing him go to the Prince Of Wales after Newbury rather than the Queen Anne. They also have Starspangledbanner to consider who is more than likely going to go sprinting but connections of the horse in Austrailia said he looks to need a mile. If he went for the Queen Anne it would leave Rip free to step up to 10 furlongs again.
 
My thinking was based on the assumption that a post-Ascot race would be more suitable with regards to the Arc, though I could see him running very well in either (or perhaps both!) the Eclipse and Juddmonte. I can't imagine he will head back to Leopardstown anyway; they are bound to have a more suitable horse I'd imagine, be it St. Nicholas Abbey, Rip Van Winkle or something else.

I'd love to see them give him a Dylan Thomas type campaign.
 
None of us can say for certain if he will progress this year or be soured by his last 3 races.I strongly suspect APOB will want him to enjoy Sunday and not be subjected to a hard race.I would be looking to lay him if he is ridiculously short.
 
I was on The Curragh today - the ground is horrible - very deep and wet. Fantastic day today and predicted right through the weekend - making it likely to be extremely tacky and tiring.
 
1 10 Fame And Glory (GB)(128) (APO'Brien) . 9,08
2 8 Baron De'l(98) (EPHarty) .(B) 9,04
3 1 Raise Your Heart(106) (Ms.JMorgan) RPCleary 9,04
4 9 She's Our Mark (GB)(106) (PJFlynn) DMGrant 9,03
5 5 Big Robert (GB)(93) (PDDeegan) KTO'Neill(C) 9,01
6 2 Dixie Music(100) (APO'Brien) . 9,01
7 3 Gan Amhras(117) (JSBolger) KJManning 9,01
8 7 Popmurphy (GB)(95) (PDDeegan) JamesCrowley(B) 9,01
9 4 Estephe(86) (TStack) WMLordan 8,12
10 6 Precious Gem(92) (DKWeld) PJSmullen 8,12

Bolger's horse would be interesting, getting 7lbs, if he came back to his best form. I'll also be interested to see how Dixie Music does this year. I was quite impressed with him when he won his maiden at Leopardstown but he didn't race again.
 
I wouldn't be getting too excited about the run as we don't know what his real fitness level was and the ground is tacky enough. Need another run on better ground to decide but you wouldn't be running to back him in a group 1.
 
Just back in from the races - more than happy with the horse, blowing a house down after the race. Travelled like the best horse in the race, came there to win it and blew up. Ganay next up.
 
He's probably one of the most over-rated animals in a long time. He is absurdly flattered by last year's proximity to STS.

I hope they take him to the Ganay, they'll be some comedy value in betting horses against him.
 
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