New Approach

Personally can't see why everyone gets at Manning. He won the Derby on him pulling like a train, I think people need to accept he was beaten by 2 better horses on Saturday who are both elder than him. It takes alot for 3yo's to beat 4yo's and personally think people underate Phoenix Tower, a top class fast ground performer.

NA pulled on from Pipedreamer in 4th, now take PT out the race, you have a 2.5l winning Duke with NA a couple clear of Pipedreamer. I think that wouldn't have been a bad performance in most people's eyes.

Yes the horse pulls but thats nothing to do with Manning and tbh I've seen many horses run away with Spencer. He's good at burying them out the rear, but I don't think many of his rides pull. Now Hughsie, thats a different story all together, he is great at settling horses, only problem is he forgets to wake them up again.
 
I think that's a very good post Chris, eps regarding the age difference - I tend ot forget DOM is a year older as basically we have only had two seasons of him [I also agree re Phoenix Tower, unlucky to keep coming up against Ballydoyle at the height of AOB's powers].

Also SL's in pointing out how hard it is to control a puller, it's something non-riders don't always understand - and an out of control horse is dangerous in any circumstances, inc a Group 1!

Manning isn't perfect but he does know the horse inside out and has done a lot of work on him - and everyone is open about the fact that he has temperament problems. He may settle better next year if he stays in training.

I would never like to see Spencer on him. Yes he can settle horses but would leave it too late - he's not good on G1 horses unless he rides them up with the pace [viz Excellent Art]. He'd frustrate NA completely imo
 
Jarvis and Robinson had the same problem with Rakti. They had pretty mixed results with trying to allow him to lead.
 
Shadow Leader said:
Ok, so it was a bit facetious - but in all seriousness if a free horse is allowed to pull his way to the front, he tends to do far too much and have nothing left for the final stages.

There is a very fine line between trying to settle a horse who is pulling hard and letting him pull himself to the front whilst maintaining control - so fine a line that it is very easy to cross and you'll find that in letting him have his head to get to the front you can easily lose the tiny modicum of control that you already hold in keeping him where you want him, fighting you or not. Once those reins are let out a notch and you let them have their own way, no matter how small, they tend to take a foot when offering half an inch and it can be so easy to suddenly realise that actually, the horse has stolen a tiny march on you in seeing that daylight and actually, he is winning that battle. It can so easily go downhill from there! It is often the best course to sit and suffer - ie sit in behind and let them fight you!
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Super post SL, it was a point I was trying to make earlier but not as well put.

For New Approach to be ridden handy, Manning would have had to let the horse go forward immeadiately from leaving the stalls. Given the horse and given the way in which the horse pulls, it would be extremely difficult to settle him a half furlong into the race after initially giving him his head.
 
You're not wrong. I probably used too many words and went round the houses a bit but I'm glad some people can see where I'm coming from!! :)
 
Further to SL's post, there is a big difference between a horse which wants to lead but will allow the pace be dictated by the jockey, and one which is trying to bolt.
 
sunybay said:
New Approach at his best is not a worse horse than phoenix Tower or the DOM that run in the newm race.
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over 10f he clearly is

if the horse had been campaigned at the correct distance his last 3 form figures would have been 111

instead he is some kind of nearly horse at different distances
 
SL's post was just the kind that's good to read.

If NA pulls so much, then presumably he got laid like no-one's business after 10 seconds on Betfair?

Is it fair to say that any horse pulling like that has little chance in a race of the highest company?
Or even just 'no' chance?

(btw I don't lay horses on any exchanges & don't plan to, either! something slightly distasteful about laying - but that's a personal thing.)

Regards
 
"Is it fair to say that any horse pulling like that has little chance in a race of the highest company?
Or even just 'no' chance?"

He won The Derby after doing a similar thing, of course that begs the question of whether The Derby is "the highest company".;)
 
yeh and next time Sheikh Mo calls for an update just slip it in at the end of the conversation 'By the way I'm expecting him to be a lot better behaved the next day'...'oh really' ....'yeh I have his balls on the mantle piece'..... :D
 
The RP today has:
Bolger said: “New Approach is fine today. There was always the chance he would be a bit rusty and fresh after his layoff, and that's what happened at Newmarket.

“He won't be doing any really fast work between now and Leopardstown and we'll be concentrating on trying to get him to settle. We should be as successful doing that as we were before he won the Dewhurst last year.”

I give up.:confused:
 
A horse which pulls hard will always pull extra-hard after a longish layoff - he will be very 'full of himself'. The race will have taken the extra fizz out of him with a bit of luck - I very much want to see him win another G1 this year

Grey's point is very good for the non-riders here

Gareth, the analogy with Ratki also occoured to me, but that one was a proper nutter and dangerously uncontrollable when in the mood - I don't think NA is in the same league, he suffers from anxiety and over-keenness, but he's not a total headcase
 
Grey said:
Further to SL's post, there is a big difference between a horse which wants to lead but will allow the pace be dictated by the jockey, and one which is trying to bolt.
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Absolutely, and apologies for not making that distinction within my post.
 
They should ride him the way El Condor Pasa was ridden in his Arc. I`m fairly sure we have no Montjeu`s in the line-up this year.
 
Galileo said:
I seem to remember Kinane boxing the horse in only for the horse to perform miracles and get up to win!
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I don't remember that bit, I just remember thinking he wasn't going to get there and than he did....just about...how good was montjeu. He had a great turn of foot.
 
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