New initiatives

Gamla Stan said:
All excellent Aragorn, but far too modern for the BHA.
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Therein lies the problem..... Someone should remind them that the 80's finished nearly 20 years ago.

The classics will always and should always remain the pinnacle of equine excellence but I tell my friends it's the guineas weekend and they think i'm talking about small furry animals.. Racing needs to engage people because normally once they've been to a racecourse and it's explained to people what is going on they generally enjoy it.

To give an example, some of my friends (I'm 29) came racing with me and not being the brightest lads in the world did not really grasp how odds worked let alone how the handicap system worked. Once i had explained it to them though and they understood what the form was telling them they all of a sudden grasped the concept and ended up having a great day. I know for a fact if I had not been there they would have walked out feeling like they had been fleeced and would not go back unless it was for a stag do. Some of them want to take the kids next time we go because they can see it's something they would enjoy.

Education on racecourses is something that should be invested in. People will always enjoy something more if they understand and appreciate what is going on. This could be achieved in a number of ways: 1) racecards 2) the RP 3) information stands (BRand them something obvious like "racing and betting explained") 4) Electronic Information points (Much like they have in shopping centres) 5) Activities for the kids which are educational as well as fun 6) Paddock Info Points - Provide equine physiology diagrams as well as racecard explanations at the paddock side 7) Broadcast live interviews over the tannoys - Pre race trainer interviews and post race jockey interviews 8) Tell members of the public where they can and can't go more clearly - My friends certainly would not have known you could watch racing from inside the track at Towcester 9) Encourage people to engage with these activities through incentives - Free bets, cheaper entry next time they visit, drink offers etc etc 10) Sign people up to news services - I'm amazed I have never been asked for my e-mail address on a racecourse. I'm only ever asked if I want beer from a backpack!!!

People don't want to be patronised but they will listen if you speak to them on a level. They don't care if the horse is by Montjeu out of a listed winning mare, they do care if it won it's last race by 2 lengths and the jockey is Frankie Dettori. The latter info is more explanable and makes a massive difference.

The BHA needs some young blood - I'm fed up in the car industry if you want me to come on board!!!!!
 
Aragorn said:
10) Sign people up to news services - I'm amazed I have never been asked for my e-mail address on a racecourse. I
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So obvious, yet it doesn't happen. Every other leisure industry does it as a matter of course.

I think whilst simplifying it is good, James Willoughby made a good point that there should also be complex stats available too, young people love to engage in stats and manipulate them. Other sports have every stat and figure under the sun readily available for free on various websites. Why can't I see how many handicap winners Dettori has ridden on the July Course in August for the last 8 years? I could find similar stats in other sports quite easily.
 
I agree Stan and would not advocate dumbing the sport down because it's complexity is one of things that attracts me to it, however, it is also a barrier to entry for a lot of people.

I happened to have the inclination and persistence when I was about 22 to spend time learning and understanding about this great sport. As a result I get more out of it than I ever have from other sports. I would suggest I am in the minority though and it's people with a casual interest that need to be given that initial education and reason to understand and get involved.

Willoughby does have a habit of being overly verbose and complex unfortunately. Whilst I like his writing it can be tinged with pomposity and cleverly written rhetoric which your average joe won't understand. I think we need some ante-willoughby's in the sport as well. I hate to say it but a young (And more modern) version of Mcririck would help the sport no end. Him and Dettori are still the only two people most people have heard of in racing (Maybe Fallon as well but for all the wrong reasons) and how long have they been around now?

Ironically with all of this I think you would be better asking Sheikh Mohammed to help rather than the authorities. For all the negative comments he may attract about his buying decisions he is still probably the most important figure in the UK in terms of supporting racing positively.
 
I think you can have complex stats as well as simplicity though, there's nothing to stop a full "idiots" guide in the racecard, audio/visual displays at racecourses as well as things like sectional timings being available freely and quickly.
 
Aragorn,

I disagree completely with your last point. Dumbing down racing (via it's media) would be the wrong way to go about it. For example, a friend of mine who didn't know very much about cricket at the beginning of the summer, has spent a lot of time watching Sky's coverage of the Ashes, which is excellent but not in any way dumbed down, and cricket is probably more complex to grasp for newcomers. However, my friend found he quickly came up to speed with the technical aspects and has therefore gained a much greater understanding of the sport than before, and has mentioned that next time I am back in England we should go to a game. This is the approach racing needs to take, be confident in what it has to offer, and not make it a circus in order for people to be attracted to the sport.
 
Well there's an obvious point for starters, the presentation of free to air racing in the UK is absolutely diabolical. I don't have one positive word to say about it.
 
They treat the sport like it is a circus, looking for human interest stories wherever possible. To compare again, Cricket doesn't do this, the coverage is as a result much better and people are able to relate better with the sport.
 
The BHA proposals seem reasonable to me, apart from the one about concluding the premier flat season with a bang in September. Surely this should happen at Newmarket on its Champions Day?

Aragorn's ideas make plenty of sense.
 
Maybe we should set up a link on the BHA website to this thread! Some pretty sound (and wholely basic) ideas that would help alot.
 
I'm lost already - it claims there will be 12 months of racing under both codes, and then reckons it can offer definitive answers to the Phantom Novice who asks when the Flat season starts and ends? The Flat season doesn't start or end: the Turf Flat season starts and ends, while the AW twiddles about a bit in the summer, and kicks in full-time from autumn to late spring.

What it can no longer definitively answer is when NH racing starts and ends, because there is no NH racing as such any more, since the inception of 'summer jumping'. If 'racing' wants to ditch its fusty image, it ought to start by ditching the term 'National Hunt' and just opt for 'Jumps racing' instead. Most people can relate to that, while a generation is growing up without any understanding of the old foundations of the sport - hunting. Might as well kick out the old ways and fully adapt to the new, if that isn't too revolutionary a concept?
 
Couldn't agree more Kri. I can just see that going down well with the regulars at Wincanton...

There is no way that any UK meeting will compete with the Arc or Breeders Cup as a season finale, trainers in the UK and abroad see the Arc and Breeders Cup as the end of season targets, and that won't change. It'd be better to try and combine with the French authorities to have a European event rivalling the Breeders Cup, but 5-6 weeks before, staged over a weekend combining the Arc with other prestigious races, perhaps have some staged at Newmarket on the Saturday and the others at Longchamp on the Sunday. This is of course, pie in the sky and the ramblings of a madman but you know....
 
Yep no problem with ditching the words 'National Hunt'

I also wonder if the thickies who can't understand fractions might not relate better to decimals?
 
Gamla Stan said:
It'd be better to try and combine with the French authorities to have a European event rivalling the Breeders Cup, but 5-6 weeks before, staged over a weekend combining the Arc with other prestigious races, perhaps have some staged at Newmarket on the Saturday and the others at Longchamp on the Sunday. This is of course, pie in the sky and the ramblings of a madman but you know....
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I think there's scope for a European Cup revolving between Ascot, Longchamp and the Curragh, but scheduling and pooling races is going to be difficult, and for such time as the French authorities feel they hold the end of season crown jewels (which they do) they won't co-operate. In any event, the French aren't under anything like the same pressure to push the sport in terms of interest and attendances that the British are
 
Unlike National Hunt, where the racing is confined to just Britain and Ireland, the flat season and flat racing is just far to international for the BHA to expect to make Britain the focus of every top yard in Europe and beyond.

I think the Arc is just going to get bigger and bigger (including the rest of the races on the day) while the Breeders Cup provides the likes of Coolmore and Godolphin with an window to the American breeders.
 
Colin Phillips said:
Wasn't there talk of team tactics, at least, when Fallon was in the event? Not laying all the blame at Kieran's feet, by the way.
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Correct. Fallon rode Jasmick for Hughie Morrison in the Stayers Handicap in 2002.

Timeform Perpsective stated

The most controversial race on the card, and the one in which the unique format of the event seemed to play the biggest part, what looked a fairly tightly-knit handicap turned into a procession by Mana d'Argent after one of his rider's team, Jasmick, was asked to increase the pace markedly around halfway; the form is best treated with a bit of caution.
JASMICK seemed to be ridden as an unadvertised pacemaker and, not surprisingly ran well below form tried beyond 14f for the first time, rushed up to the lead around halfway, soon clear but headed and weakening quickly turning in.
 
Gamla Stan said:
Especially with Betfair being in decimals which leads the fields in marketing racing for the betting industry.
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Not just Betfair, but overseas Totes too.

You try explainign 100/30 to an idiot in terms of putting on £30 to win £100, and the first thing they say is they don't want to put on £30. You'd be surprised, it can be that straight forward and deter people. Remember the British consumer is conditioned to seeing a price on a shelf and accepting it. We don't haggle (although i remember watching Barry Dennis blow a fuse at someone who tried it!!! - poor Barry it was quite funny, :lol: and a complete clash of cultures in this case). Dennis was trying to explain to the guy that the decision on price was his, and his alone, and the other fella who must have had more of a haggling culture was trying to point out that others were price dup better than Dennis, and that he expected him to match or better there price. Barry simply told him to go and bet with them then, and the fella said he didn't want to. he wanted Barry to beat their prices.

I digress - 100/30 - yes

When they grasp the idea of a minimum stakes and punters deciding how much they can put on, then they're required to perform calcualtion which a lot of people are uncomfortable with and embarrased to demonstrate. I'm sure they'd find decimals and increasing return in a ratio to incremental £1 stakes easier to grasp
 
Warbler said:
I think there's scope for a European Cup revolving between Ascot, Longchamp and the Curragh, but scheduling and pooling races is going to be difficult, and for such time as the French authorities feel they hold the end of season crown jewels (which they do) they won't co-operate. In any event, the French aren't under anything like the same pressure to push the sport in terms of interest and attendances that the British are
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Agree - it's a good idea, but there's nothing in it for the French, who are already swimming in their Qatarian (?) Arc-weekend money.
 
While we're dickering around with figures, let's ditch stones and pounds and at least go for either all pounds, like the Yanks, or kilos. And do let's get shot of furlongs, for once and for all - otherwise, we might as well bring back roods to measure the enclosures!

The whole bag needs a damn good shake, and I agree about getting shot of fractions if Betfair does decimals - how much confusion does one sport need?
 
Hamm said:
Aragorn,

I disagree completely with your last point. Dumbing down racing (via it's media) would be the wrong way to go about it. For example, a friend of mine who didn't know very much about cricket at the beginning of the summer, has spent a lot of time watching Sky's coverage of the Ashes, which is excellent but not in any way dumbed down, and cricket is probably more complex to grasp for newcomers. However, my friend found he quickly came up to speed with the technical aspects and has therefore gained a much greater understanding of the sport than before, and has mentioned that next time I am back in England we should go to a game. This is the approach racing needs to take, be confident in what it has to offer, and not make it a circus in order for people to be attracted to the sport.
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Hi Hamm, I probably didn't make myself clear enough - I'm not advocating the dumbing down of racing, far from it!! That would be a disaster as the complexity is what attracts me (I think I said this in a previous post). I'm only advocating the introduction of an on and off course education, which experienced punters like ourselves can ignore, but the first timers and children can engage with. Everyone has to start somewhere and that's the point i'm trying to make I think. I bet a lot of people on here went years without understanding things properly until they had it explained to them. I am also to an extent (And I guess this is where you may be taking issue) advocating bringing a bit more youth and exuberance into the sport. The journalism is often pretty stereotypical and quite staid and lacks style. I would not want to get to a situation where we have style over substance but in wider sport we have The Sun vs The Times and people can choose. I think the RP and the rest of the sport could do with trying to be a little more forward thinking and and at times dare I say it controversial in its opinion and shake up the status quo. Mcririck is almost a figure of ridicule now but he has almost been pigeon holed because he was a threat to the established way of things.
 
Warbler said:
Yep no problem with ditching the words 'National Hunt'

I also wonder if the thickies who can't understand fractions might not relate better to decimals?
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I won't go too much into the first point but there are plenty of people who would disagree with you - it's the heritage of the sport.

As for the decimalisation; why should we, as a race, have to constantly pander to the lowest common denominator? Each successive generation becomes more illiterate, stupid and unable to use the brains God gave them as it is - why make it easier? I hate dumbing down in any scenario, people should be educated instead!
 
Shadow Leader said:
I won't go too much into the first point but there are plenty of people who would disagree with you - it's the heritage of the sport.
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And they can all be found at Cheltenham's November meeting in their 4x4's with pro hunting stickers eating champagne pic nics in the car park dressed in tweed and red cord trousers. The shamefull side of our sport imo.
 
There is nothing wrong with the heritage of our sport, nor those that uphold it. Patronise all you like with talk of champagne picnics; just goes to show that you have no idea of the different walks of life that are wholly integrated with the hunting scene, most of which are your common or garden working country folk. Absolutely nothing shameful about it and the sport would not have existed in the first place without such a background.
 
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