St Leger

trackside528 said:
The difference in the rides was that Barzalona kicked on about three out on Encke (was certainly in full flight as they hit the 2f pole) whilst O'Brien didn't get after Camelot until about a furlong and a half out. In hindsight, if O'Brien had gotten after Camelot earlier, he may well have won.

Hindsight is always 20/20 though, and, in reality, O'Brien gave Camelot the ride I think most expected he would. Given that the horse had the turn of foot to win the Guineas, it wasn't unreasonable to expect that he would pick up Encke either, even given the way the race panned out.
Click to expand...

in hindsight it would have been better to send camelot to the front after a furlong...as the race wasn't overly fast he should have won doing that...if he had done that and lost..it would have been..wtf was he doing leading?

if he had kicked at the same time as Encke and lost ..most people would have said..what was he doing kicking so early when the horse has a turn of foot?

he really couldn't win could he?

for a horse that had enough speed to win a less than truly run classic mile..he should have ate a slowboat like Encke at the end of a 14.5f race
 
Grey said:
I don't think you will find much praise for JOB on here this year, especially compared with previous seasons when he was still new on the scene. Fancying him to win the Irish championship is not the same thing as saying he's the best jockey in Ireland. He'll be given better opportunities to win it than anyone else and he's competent enough to take a sufficient number of them to win the title. But he's not the finished article, has weight problems and too good an alternative career as assistant to his dad to stick at it long term.
Click to expand...


Shrewd judges like me are up to their eyeballs in Joesph O'Brien for the jockey title and we will collect. However he remains a limited jockey who the like of Murtagh would have for breakfast. His big race rides this year have been nothing short of disgraceful.
 
Only seen it the once but thats about right. You felt at that point it had gone and given that the horse was clearly not floundering it has to signify a very ordinary ride at best
 
Miesque said:
Consensus here was waiting too long on the rail waiting for a gap to open giving Encke the first run. Gutting to watch.
Click to expand...

but encke's a boat..he ain't got no speed..how far would he get beat in a guineas?

talking as if Encke is some type of speed horse
 
Last edited:
Enke should probably be upgraded a bit to my eyes he pulled for a long way. It may be a case after that he was stopping and Camelot was plugging on which makes it look like the ride cost him.
 
I wouldn't be J O'B's greatest fan, but I can't really see where he did that much wrong today. He rode the horse for a turn of foot (as he has in every race, apart from deep ground in the Irish Derby) and it just wasn't there when he needed it.
Might just have won, had he gone when Encke went, but still wouldn't have been the same horse we'd seen previously, imo.
 
reet hard said:
I wouldn't be J O'B's greatest fan, but I can't really see where he did that much wrong today. He rode the horse for a turn of foot (as he has in every race, apart from deep ground in the Irish Derby) and it just wasn't there when he needed it.
Might just have won, had he gone when Encke went, but still wouldn't have been the same horse we'd seen previously, imo.
Click to expand...

Reet what did we see previously? Camelot beating up a mountain of crap. Most likely we wont see him in the Arc now but there we would have seen him scalped for good.
 
But reet.. if as assumed hes the classiest horse in the race and one that is seemingly free of quirks, then just keep him handy all the time surely? ready to pick up whatever happens?
 
Kauto said:
Enke should probably be upgraded a bit to my eyes he pulled for a long way. It may be a case after that he was stopping and Camelot was plugging on which makes it look like the ride cost him.
Click to expand...

I'd agree with this. I went today and I have to say I was shocked by the visual impression Encke made; he really quickened away after pulling hard early. Strange as it may sound but I think the best horse on the day won and in the end he did it quite snugly.
 
Aragorn said:
I'd agree with this. I went today and I have to say I was shocked by the visual impression Encke made; he really quickened away after pulling hard early. Strange as it may sound but I think the best horse on the day won and in the end he did it quite snugly.
Click to expand...

Voices of reason - the winner won snugly.. He quickly got 2 - 3 lenghts out of the field ( at a time when Camelot was out in the open) and was always holding everything from there. Didn't we have a Hamm inspired forum punt on him first time up last year? He just got chinned by a Hills horse...always looked a big raw horse that would improve with time.
 
Just watched it back again. Stand by what I said, winner definitely quickened away from Camelot once he was given a couple of cracks and it was only in the last 100yds Camelot made any inroads.
 
Brendan
Aye, but he beat much the same pile of crap today; a lot less convincingly.

Clivex
Had he been handier, he may well have won, but I'd still be unconvinced he was the same horse as previously.
 
Backed C in tje derby, had every intention of laying for the win today but was out all afternoon and never got around to it. must admit, i am extremely puzzled by the earlier comment that AOB describes him as best horse he has trained.
 
Lads, some of you may be on drugs. There was no controversy here, no jockey errors and the best horse on the day clearly won, and well.
 
On The Bridle said:
Voices of reason - the winner won snugly.. He quickly got 2 - 3 lenghts out of the field ( at a time when Camelot was out in the open) and was always holding everything from there. Didn't we have a Hamm inspired forum punt on him first time up last year? He just got chinned by a Hills horse...always looked a big raw horse that would improve with time.
Click to expand...
I would have won several grand today if self imposed ban on horse betting not in place still start of jumps. Won very well, hoped he at least place. 25s scarily good price.
 
Ask yourselves one question; when manoeuvered to make his run Camelot's head went up. Why?
When did he last run on going that quick?
The winner by Kingmambo out of an Irish Oaks winner who hopped off fast ground.
Best horse on the going won the day imo. no other excuses needed. Thats racing.
 
In hindsight JPOB's only mistake perhaps was not having supreme confidence in his stamina and failing to go on . That , however, ignores the fact that he ought to have been much the quickest horse in the race . Encke quickens away from him when Camelot is in the clear only for Camelot to stay on close home . The turn of foot was missing - and before stamina could possibly have been an issue .

Barzalona looked a prize prat nearly falling off - someone needs to have a strong word in his ear .
 
Back
Top