Novice Hurdlers 2009/2010

Gareth Flynn said:
It's the same thing, isn't it, playing it safe? The winner hasn't jumped perfectly during the season either ("driven last and blundered" at Ascot last time out) but it didn't stop Johnson taking the race by the scruff of the neck.
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The Ascot race (or should I say ride) was a disaster - the horse had jumped pretty well prior to that.

And no keeping him outwide to let the horse get a clear look at his hurdles is not over confidence but yeah it could be classed as playing it safe - but they are two different things to me.

I am really disappointed for connections of Dunguib - of whom I did not have that much faith in at the start of the season but who I think have handled everything all season with alot of skill and class.
 
Ride was completely fine. He don't jump that well I'm afraid, which was always going to make it difficult for him. He'll be fine in the tactical small-field Irish affairs, but if they tracked the leaders on the inner, he'd have been shuffled back at every flight.

He's ran to his Irish form anyway, Brits were simply better.
 
Nothing for connections of Dunguib to feel bad about - they probably ran him in the right races, were very good with the public (in the RP column) and the jockey didnt do much wrong - just ran into 2 better horses and no shame in that. You have to jump to win a championship race and he didn't.
 
By Martin Kelly, Press Association Sport

Philip Hobbs' Menorah edged out Get Me Out Of Here in a thrilling finish to the Spinal Research Supreme Novices' Hurdle at Cheltenham, with hot favourite Dunguib only third.
The latter, a hugely impressive winner of last season's Champion Bumper, was sent off at 4-5 to maintain his unbeaten record over obstacles, and was ridden with confidence by Brian O'Connell.
He went in pursuit of Menorah (12-1) and Get Me Out Of Here (9-2) in the straight, but could not reel them in.
Menorah, by contrast, found plenty for pressure under Richard Johnson to hold off totesport Trophy winner Get Me Out Of Here by a head, with Dunguib another length and three-quarters further adrift.
Johnson said: "On a couple of days this year it didn't work out for him, but today it has done and it's great to have it.
"It was a false-run race (at Ascot last time) but I always thought Cheltenham would be ideal for him with a true-run race."
Hobbs said: "He could be very good. I couldn't believe how green he was going to the second-last.
"It's a good job Richard poached the lead when he did as another 50 yards he might have been in trouble.
"He's been beaten on two occasions at Doncaster and Ascot, both times in muddling races, and that doesn't suit him at all.
"He's only five - he had a disadvantage to some of these because he's younger.
"At this stage, my first thought would be the Champion Hurdle next year rather than think about novice chasing, but we'll see."
Get Me Out Of Here's jockey Tony McCoy said: "There are no excuses, really. "I thought for a stride or two I might get there, but my horse has run his race."


Get Me Out Of Here's trainer Jonjo O'Neill added: "It was a great race, what a start to the Festival, it's just a shame we were second rather than first!
"There were no excuses - he had a great preparation and the best horse won on the day.

"This was the plan, but we'll see how we come out of it and think about Liverpool. He might jump a fence next season, but he could still be good enough for the big hurdle races." Dunguib's trainer Philip Fenton said: "First of all, we thought the pace would be much stronger, although he did travel well enough.
"He missed a hurdle out at the top of the hill and jumping the third last, we were probably fighting a losing battle.
"Brian felt they just got a couple of lengths on him coming round the bend and we were still that far down at the last.
"I wouldn't put the ground down as an excuse and although Brian felt he was a bit wide, I have no criticism whatsoever over his riding.
"After this, I think Punchestown will still be the next stop, but my inclination is to continue down the novice route with him."
Sky Bet make Dunguib 10-1 for next year's Champion Hurdle, while Stan James go 6-1.
Menorah is 12-1 for the Champion Hurdle with Boylesports and 10-1 with Sky Bet and Stan James.
 
Ascot is just one example; they're all novices after all. I'm sure most other connections in the race would have liked their horses to be able to stay out wide and off the pace in order to get a clear look at their hurdles, but knew they weren't going to win doing that.
 
After a frustrating/annoying first day courtesy of Get Me Out Of Here and The Package now in need of a little inspiration. Anyone agree that those at the front end of the Neptune could be vulnerable and Some Present may represent the value given the step up in trip on ground he enjoys? Obviously, I am a little fearful he may have had too many races on bad ground but 33/1?
 
Not to take away from the winner, but even though Dunguib seemed to be feeling something a bit, he still might have won had he been ridden more positively. Perhaps Francome was right about the shins didn't look a happy camper to me.
 
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Galileo said:
Perhaps - its a bit like Mikael D'haguenet all over again.....the same question could be asked of Rite Of Passage.
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I'm taking the view that the ground will be a positive for Rite of Passage.

He got in a bit of a muddle in last years bumper from maybe 6f out to 4f out, wasn't running in a straight line, tipping off horses and getting blocked, with the result he came up looking like a bit of a one paced plodder. He's shown he can travel much better than that and has enough pace. I'm hoping that was, at least in part, due to inexperience and I've backed him accordingly on that assumption, but I do have a niggly little worry that this isn't his course, he really didn't appreciate the undulations and there could be a repeat.

He still was always holding Quel Esprit, which probably doesn't mean a whole heap, but then you don't have a lot to go on. I really can't see why Quel Esprit should be ahead of him in the betting.
 
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Dunguib ridden by a pro round the inside would have won--- he was beaten by less ground than he lost going around the outside.
Reminded me of Phillip Carberry on Sublimlty in the Novices -- the year before he won the Champion Hurdle.
 
I am swaying toward Quel Esprit to win tomorrow based on the confidence from the stable but think Summit Surge is worth an interest. Yard will have a good line on the Mullins horse.
 
I can't see Quel Esprit out of the first three tomorrow, but i think he'll be left open to something with another gear over this trip and on this ground.

Summit Surge Gal?? Lovely horse but don't think he'd get this trip ;)
 
eric c said:
Dunguib ridden by a pro round the inside would have won--- he was beaten by less ground than he lost going around the outside.
Reminded me of Phillip Carberry on Sublimlty in the Novices -- the year before he won the Champion Hurdle.
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If he hadn't had a calamity on the hurdling front you might be right. I suspect his hurdling would have gone from sub adequate to disastrous had they stuck him in the pack. Maybe the Ruby Walsh hold up 4l off the back of the pack would have done it. Maybe they should try front running him. Maybe they should go chasing and hope that works. I don't see him ever being a good technical hurdler.

While it is fair to say he probably had the best engine in the race, it wasn't a case that he was a class apart bar the clumsy jumping and wide course. it would have been a struggle anyway.
 
Quel Esprit favourite over ROP is as silly as those who briefly punted Voler la Vedette to favouritism over Quevega - surely they will switch back in a big way tomorrow.

The only doubt I had over ROP was the ground/trip - the ground means this is no longer a worry and he can be backed worry free at an amazing price.
 
Melendez said:
If he hadn't had a calamity on the hurdling front you might be right. I suspect his hurdling would have gone from sub adequate to disastrous had they stuck him in the pack. Maybe the Ruby Walsh hold up 4l off the back of the pack would have done it. Maybe they should try front running him. Maybe they should go chasing and hope that works. I don't see him ever being a good technical hurdler.

While it is fair to say he probably had the best engine in the race, it wasn't a case that he was a class apart bar the clumsy jumping and wide course. it would have been a struggle anyway.
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Exactly about the disastrous jumping if ridden mid pack.

Why does there have to be an excuse? He is not as good as the other two, and O'Connell should not be used as an excuse. Why can't people just accept the other 2 are better - it is clear cut.
 
Hamm said:
Exactly about the disastrous jumping if ridden mid pack.

Why does there have to be an excuse? He is not as good as the other two, and O'Connell should not be used as an excuse. Why can't people just accept the other 2 are better - it is clear cut.
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I think the distances suggest it is not clear cut.

Either way he is not the Golden Cgynet Part II was some of us hoped to see.
 
What's not clear cut about it?

There are no excuses for Dunguib, and it annoys me the prior hype means he is the talking point(more so in the media), and not the 2 very good horses ahead of him. There is no reason whatsoever to believe he can turn this form around.
 
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