The Debate

trackside528 said:
The Alliance Party has just taken Belfast East from Peter Robinson.

That has absolutely made my night. All else aside, for the Alliance party to have an MP is fantastic. Real progress.
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I literally fell off the couch. I had to rewind to make sure I'd heard it right. Result of the night without a doubt.
 
Politics in this country is simple.

Labour takes from the rich to give to the poor.

Tories take from the poor and give to the rich.

Lib Dems take off both then give them it back.

The others don't know what to do.
 
Gareth Flynn said:
I literally fell off the couch. I had to rewind to make sure I'd heard it right. Result of the night without a doubt.
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Wasn't even particularly close either - a huge 22% swing to Alliance. Naomi Long should be a fantastic MP for the area - Robinson is surely finished now. He had a brass neck for sticking it out through the early crises this year, but surely the knives are hovering over his back now.

Should be good craic at South Fermanagh later - what's the rules for a dead heat? :blink:
 
I think SL would like a return to Victorian times when the poor were kept quite in their little towns and the country people were free to fuck and kill eveything in site. Including their own families
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Must admit, i burst out laughing at that one. Nice. But should have been especially their own families

Formally a hung parliament. First election where all three main parties have failed.

The Green could hold balance of power
 
Desert Orchid said:
Politics in this country is simple.

Labour takes from the rich to give to the poor.

Tories take from the poor and give to the rich.

Lib Dems take off both then give them it back.

The others don't know what to do.
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I think Labour take from the rich to make everyone poorer , socialdemocrats love poor people and thats why they reproduce them.


Conservative lower tax and deficit and people live better , also labourist voters are happy living better insulting the tories and blaming them of everything it happens in the world.


In Spain it is the same.
 
Actually, the workers were living exceptionally well until she began closing the mines, down to the UK's production being unviably overpriced, thanks to the miners holding the country - rich and poor alike - hostage to their demands. That the closures led to house repossessions, clinical depression and entire communities left moribund for decades since - you could say that that was down to the workers having shot themselves in their own feet. And during and since that time, the UK has gone on to price itself out of its own markets in shipping, steel, and most heavy industry bar armaments, which it's quite happy to peddle to all and any with the money to buy.

Let's not oversentimentalise 'the workers', DO. Their living standards were at an all-time high until they got greedy. It would've been interesting to have seen how a Labour govt. would've handled the situation at the time. I suspect pretty much the same, unless it wanted full-scale anarchy.
 
Tories hold Newmarket, Lambourn, Epsom and Ewell, Middleham and Catterick. Looks most unlikely that Lord Derby's plans to build loads of houses will get off the ground for a few more years, anyway.
 
Do ...you should surely know better than that simplistic statement

Krizon...Re-reading a history of the 70s ("when the lights went out"...fine book) reminded me that it was very likely that labour would have gone a some distance down that route. It was clear to everyone that union power was out of hand and that continual heavy subsidies for non productive jobs in hopelssly run nationlised industries (Leyland anyone?) could not continue. Callaghan and healey were well aware of this

Many many non-rich people were freed up by Thatcher's drive and policies to make something of themselves. It wasnt just the nuts and bolts of the tax regimes or incentives to do so, but it was the "can do" culture. There were certainly some downsides, but to suggest only the rich got richer under the tories is complete rubbish

Britain is naturally an enterprising country. Its ingrained. It badly needed releasing fom the dead hand of from socialism
 
clivex said:
Do ...you should surely know better than that simplistic statement
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I should, but I'm trying to be controversial!

I did get better off during Thatcher's years, I should admit, but I watched neighbours and friends around me get left behind.

I was/am a 'professional', as is Mrs O, and our joint incomes would put us very nicely into the 'very-likely-to-do-well-under-the-tories' category. But we'd rather pay more in taxes and see the money go towards easing poverty among those who really need help.

My father had a car at the start of Thatcher's 'reign'. He didn't by the end of it because he couldn't afford it.
 
We have a new Labout MP called Toby :(

mind you..its no wonder Nick Clegg hasn't managed to to keep the faith of the people of Chesterfiled in Paul Holmes..no matter how well those pointless debates were publicised

http://youve-been-cromwelled.org/?p=270

without that i'm sure PH would have still been in.

does the failure of the lib dems generally now mean that Clegg has to go?

Holmes lost by 500 votes
 
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I worry about this country after watching this election ...

first of all, despite what 'Dave' tells you, there is potentially nothing wrong with a hung parliament - 10 of the 16 countries with AAA credit ratings have these, so if these economies can work, why not Britain?

why is the fact the Tories have left VAT out of their manifesto receiving so little coverage? They have been blathering on about the NI increase, while all the time it is evident that once that man Osborne gets in, VAT will go up, probably to 20% - you tell me what's worse. Anyone with a basic understanding of economics, or even maths, cannot possibly have voted Tory.

Another thing, the amount of people who will vote for the Tories as Brown is this and that astound me - this isn't x-factor. ask these people why and you get various insults.

Ask the same people where Britain would be if the Tories were in charge when Northern rock etc were crumbling, and you get a shrug. The answer is Britain would now be in as bad a position as Greece.

The most worrying story of the election for me was Wade and young Murdoch bursting into the independent newspaper's offices to ask how dare they print negative stories about dear Rupert. This followed by the ridiculous Mail/Express/Sun/Telegraph headlines makes you wonder what kind of country you live in.
 
Of course, the other thing that truly astounds me is that two countries so close to each other geographically (Scotland and England) can have such a different attitude to the political parties!
 
VAT will go up, probably to 20% - you tell me what's worse
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In terms of job creation and thus regenerating the domestic economy, putting up NI is definately the worst option. VAT is applied to imported goods and services as well as domestic. NI increase is a pure tax on domestic job creation
 
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I don't have a big problem with VAT, so long as it is levied on genuinely luxury items, not on food or other essentials. That way only those who can afford it have to pay.
 
I suspect that will remain the case, even under the tories

Ask the same people where Britain would be if the Tories were in charge when Northern rock etc were crumbling, and you get a shrug. The answer is Britain would now be in as bad a position as Greece.
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Andrew. That is very debatable. Greeces problems are down to a bloated public sector draining the economy whilst the wealth creation of the private sector floundered. Which party would be more likely to address a similar problem in the UK?
 
The Tories, if you mean public sector. Whilst the comparison I made was a poor one in one sense, it was meant to show (albeit arriving in different ways) what a mess the economy would be in if Osborne had been at the helm at that time.
 
The tories wouldn't confirm that re VAT, labour would - says a lot.

VAT will bring a massive rise in inflation, and this will not aid any recovery.
 
Shadow Leader said:
It's really not so unbelievable. No-one with a braincell in their head doesn't want this arsehole Brown out, no-one can surely stand the nancy-boy poofy tree hugging Lib Dems and the rest aren't worth a toss other than the Tories.

Oh, and take the piss, but getting hunting back is fucking important to some of us "horsey twats". Not that you townie twats would have a scooby.
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what do you think the tories will do that will be beneficial to you SL?
 
I haven't really being following this but I was wondering see as The Tories sadi they where going to cut expenditure on Northern Ireland will this unite The Ulster parties in doing a deal with Labour. How many Seats are there in the north ?
 
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