Will Altior Be Beaten?

Altior is more likely to win at Ascot over 2.5 than he is at Haydock, particularly with the Nicholls horses very in and out at the moment. The only thing is I'm not sure it'll tell them anything.

I really have no idea why Nicky would want to take on Bristol De Mai, Lostintranslation, and Frodon on soft/heavy ground over three miles at Haydock though. Makes no sense to me at all.

Nothing to gain in my mind, so if he's going to the King George prep him over two. It hardly matters when it's a fitness exercise for Boxing Day does it, and there's less risk of getting to the bottom of him over a trip on this ground.
 
I absolutely adore Altior but Cyrname's win in the Betfair Ascot chase last season made the hairs on my neck stand on end. The best chasing performance I witnessed last season. Altior going this distance for the first time and 5 furlongs further than he has ever raced at a track where he can jump out to the left at a lot of the fences. I have to back Cyrname to win this. Can't wait and just hope they both have clear rounds.

There is an interesting article on the sporting life site which includes a short video of Henderson & Nicholls visiting each others yards.
https://www.sportinglife.com/racing/news/altior-v-cyrname-the-talking-points/174201
 
In my view, Altior has been regressing (from his brilliant best) since his first QM win. Whatever happens at the weekend, I don't see him winning a KG or a Gold Cup. The QM will depend on what turns up but he's of no interest at the current prices.
 
Wins on Saturday for me but....
Won't get the trip for the KG & will end up back trying to retain his Champion Chase come March.
 
I've got taken in by the odd freak performance horse over the years, but I hope Cryname isn't another.

Will know when the time comes and the screw is turned

Will he have the stomach for it
 
Hopefully he will see him off with the same authority that Sprinter saw off Sanctuaire at Sandown.

But Id still prefer him to stay over 2 miles


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archie said:
In my view, Altior has been regressing (from his brilliant best) since his first QM win. Whatever happens at the weekend, I don't see him winning a KG or a Gold Cup. The QM will depend on what turns up but he's of no interest at the current prices.
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I have the same impression from last season that Altior has gone as high as he can go, and the question now is how gentle the glide path back down the ratings will be.
 
I'm a huge fan of Altior but worry - like others - about the levels he's been hitting in the last season or so.

He keeps winning but hasn't been impressing until after the last fence.

I'm sure I read NdB has been saying he needs further than 2 miles now and early in his career they were saying he was bred for further but didn't see the need to go up in trip as he was so good at the minimum, just as they had done with Sprinter Sacre.

I don't want him to go to Haydock first time up. It's closer to 3m 2f and that would worry me.

Cyrname got a massive rating from me last season and would be a formidable opponent at Ascot.

Henderson and his team don't make many mistakes, though, and I'm sure they'll do right by the horse. I won't be betting in either race if he turns up.
 
Been looking in fairly regularly, Granger, but prioritising other issues for the time being. Meaningful discussion will always catch my attention though!
 
Nicholls generally has his top horses raring to go fto if the race is important enough. Politologue ran close to his best on Sunday. Cyrname wasn't one of his top horses at the start of last year or the year before - so his never having won fto is an angle that's being overplayed.
 
and was rather precocious

A horse like Cyrname will likely have a short shelf life at the top owing to his racing style and pedigree compared to an Irish pointer

Nicholls has had a tonne of horses like this over the years

He has 2 years to max cash this horse. Wherever he runs, he'll be ready to win
 
Won't believe this clash is happening until they are lining up to be honest!!

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Nicky reiterating today that he's basically a speed horse and is only stepping up in trip because of public pressure. Personally think he'll be in the Tingle Creek.
 
Must say, the pessimist in me really doubts this clash will actually happen. I hope I'm wrong, but like littlelad & Bonjers have alluded to, I won't believe it until I see it!

If you are also that way inclined does it make a lot of sense to take the Antepost 5/4 about Cyrname now?
Even if Altior shows up, that's a fair price and unlikely to get much bigger on the day imo.
If Altior doesn't show up, then Cyrname is a penalty kick and you have 5/4 about a horse that goes off what, 1/3 ?
 
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I don't think you could face up to a more difficult rival in the circumstances when you're looking to step up in trip, hence my suspicion that Nicky will look elsewhere.

I really don't see how you can crab Cyrname's form at the track unless you're saying that all five behind him last time out have run to circa 150.

Even then, factoring in the distance he's beaten them, he's at least on a par with the best of the rest that Altior has been beating over 2m at 165-167 or so.

We know he can see out the distance, we all think Altior will handle the step up, but there's only one horse who has the form in the book to prove it.

The ease in which Cyrname travels here is astonishing and I suspect he'll have Altior in trouble at some point. If Altior has the ability to sit in his wake and go past him, then fair play. He's an unbelievable horse at is, he'd hit a whole new level for me if he can pull that off.

It's not a betting proposition, but I'll be glued to the screen if it does indeed happen.
 
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